"Freedom to be curious about our sin" can be so transformative. For me, trying to start thinking about how to talk to my sons about sex is what gave me permission to go back and think about confusing/shameful/embarrassing experiences I had buried. And I've found that God has a ruthless willingness to pull all those experiences back into my story and redeem them by making them a source of discovery and growth.
Do you think the conversation you imagine in the last paragraph would have helped the man in Home Depot? I have a strong suspicion that he would have experienced any discussion of his "mother wound" and "lover heart" as a terrifying attack, not an offer of help.
I saw a similar t-shirt last summer, and after fantasizing about possible responses that were really just ways to attack and embarrass him by calling out his brokenness, I concluded that the only actually helpful thing I could have offered would be that curiosity. "Hey, I can't quite puzzle out what that shirt means.... Oh, huh, I had some vague sense that was a thing, but I never understood the appeal. Could you explain it to me? Am I missing out?"
I suspect that having to explain it in ordinary, sober language might change his perspective a bit. And that having someone listen without complicity but with curiosity rather than judgement might unravel some of the hopeless sense of his own brokenness that I imagine must be behind that aggressive front.
You are absolutely right. My last paragraph would have been offensive and unhelpful to him. That's why I didn't say it. He was clearly too disconnected and too defensive for any of that to be helpful to him. And I doubt I was in a kind enough place to confront him anyway.
Your invitation to explain the shirt might have been more copacetic in this case. I like it. Thanks for the creative idea!
I saw the same “sentiment” a few months ago, screaming from the back window of a car in the Walmart parking lot. My immediate reaction was, “What a classless idiot”. Now I feel bad that I didn’t react with some deeper thinking and even with compassion as you have.
Believe me, my first impulse was to feel the offense and dismiss the guy too. I only didn't because my curiosity got the best of me. And I help men walk through their stories of sexual formation and I had a hunch more was going on.
Man, I think you are looking far too much into a simple fetish. For some, wanting to bang a mother represents some deep Fruedian excuse to get back at a controlling mother figure in your life. For others, it's a simple attraction, like how someone might be attracted to red heads or scientists.
While of course I think that shirt was probably... not suitable for public wearing, I don't see it as some deep and profound key into the man's innermost psyche. Who knows, maybe the man is married to a wife and has children, and wears it as some sort of ironic statement. He in fact, does love MILFs, and has married one. You can't know the depth of his character from a simple shirt.
First thanks for reading and even reflecting back to me your thoughts. Let me try to draw some nuance.
What arouses us (our arousal structure) is separate from our sexual desire. They may overlap and converge for sure. But they can be different. And our arousal structure is an impressionable part of us, impacted by our stories and experiences. That seems unanimous among writers on sexuality that I've read. They can certainly hold the good of our desires and attractions. But can hold more too, our trauma our unmet needs, etc. Thereby, they are well worth our deep reflection. Here is one other sex writer Esther Perel in her own words. “Your fantasy life is the ultimate secret code. Your prevalent fantasies reveal your deepest needs because a good fantasy states the problem and offers the solution.” My next article is all about this exploration work.
Am I being too hard on this guy? Maybe. I certainly don't now him or his character. That is true and I'll reflect on your feedback that I did malign him. But he did invite me to read his shirt. And I just can't see it being a way to express his gratitude and attraction to his wife. Would a wife feel honored by that as an expression of love? I know we disagree, but that seems more far fetched than what I've written.
Women over 30 with children is NOT a fetish. A fetish is a whole other thing. And this was not about porn. He was making a statement to the kinds of "older" women who comprise MILFs. Many men will not go near a woman with kids. That's exactly what a MILF is.
You are of course welcome to your opinion. I would love to be wrong about this guy. But he didn't have a "I love women over 30 with children" shirt. That would land very different in my opinion. I am going on my understanding of the history of the term MILF, which came into popularity from the American Pie movie and fetishized by porn. I have never seen it being used as a slogan of solidarity with mothers and that feels hard to imagine.
"Freedom to be curious about our sin" can be so transformative. For me, trying to start thinking about how to talk to my sons about sex is what gave me permission to go back and think about confusing/shameful/embarrassing experiences I had buried. And I've found that God has a ruthless willingness to pull all those experiences back into my story and redeem them by making them a source of discovery and growth.
Do you think the conversation you imagine in the last paragraph would have helped the man in Home Depot? I have a strong suspicion that he would have experienced any discussion of his "mother wound" and "lover heart" as a terrifying attack, not an offer of help.
I saw a similar t-shirt last summer, and after fantasizing about possible responses that were really just ways to attack and embarrass him by calling out his brokenness, I concluded that the only actually helpful thing I could have offered would be that curiosity. "Hey, I can't quite puzzle out what that shirt means.... Oh, huh, I had some vague sense that was a thing, but I never understood the appeal. Could you explain it to me? Am I missing out?"
I suspect that having to explain it in ordinary, sober language might change his perspective a bit. And that having someone listen without complicity but with curiosity rather than judgement might unravel some of the hopeless sense of his own brokenness that I imagine must be behind that aggressive front.
You are absolutely right. My last paragraph would have been offensive and unhelpful to him. That's why I didn't say it. He was clearly too disconnected and too defensive for any of that to be helpful to him. And I doubt I was in a kind enough place to confront him anyway.
Your invitation to explain the shirt might have been more copacetic in this case. I like it. Thanks for the creative idea!
I saw the same “sentiment” a few months ago, screaming from the back window of a car in the Walmart parking lot. My immediate reaction was, “What a classless idiot”. Now I feel bad that I didn’t react with some deeper thinking and even with compassion as you have.
We learn every day. Thank you for the lesson.
Believe me, my first impulse was to feel the offense and dismiss the guy too. I only didn't because my curiosity got the best of me. And I help men walk through their stories of sexual formation and I had a hunch more was going on.
Just finished reading Unwanted, by Jay Stringer. I’m glad to see you writing on this. It’s close to my heart.
I love Jay and his work!
Man, I think you are looking far too much into a simple fetish. For some, wanting to bang a mother represents some deep Fruedian excuse to get back at a controlling mother figure in your life. For others, it's a simple attraction, like how someone might be attracted to red heads or scientists.
While of course I think that shirt was probably... not suitable for public wearing, I don't see it as some deep and profound key into the man's innermost psyche. Who knows, maybe the man is married to a wife and has children, and wears it as some sort of ironic statement. He in fact, does love MILFs, and has married one. You can't know the depth of his character from a simple shirt.
First thanks for reading and even reflecting back to me your thoughts. Let me try to draw some nuance.
What arouses us (our arousal structure) is separate from our sexual desire. They may overlap and converge for sure. But they can be different. And our arousal structure is an impressionable part of us, impacted by our stories and experiences. That seems unanimous among writers on sexuality that I've read. They can certainly hold the good of our desires and attractions. But can hold more too, our trauma our unmet needs, etc. Thereby, they are well worth our deep reflection. Here is one other sex writer Esther Perel in her own words. “Your fantasy life is the ultimate secret code. Your prevalent fantasies reveal your deepest needs because a good fantasy states the problem and offers the solution.” My next article is all about this exploration work.
Am I being too hard on this guy? Maybe. I certainly don't now him or his character. That is true and I'll reflect on your feedback that I did malign him. But he did invite me to read his shirt. And I just can't see it being a way to express his gratitude and attraction to his wife. Would a wife feel honored by that as an expression of love? I know we disagree, but that seems more far fetched than what I've written.
Women over 30 with children is NOT a fetish. A fetish is a whole other thing. And this was not about porn. He was making a statement to the kinds of "older" women who comprise MILFs. Many men will not go near a woman with kids. That's exactly what a MILF is.
You are of course welcome to your opinion. I would love to be wrong about this guy. But he didn't have a "I love women over 30 with children" shirt. That would land very different in my opinion. I am going on my understanding of the history of the term MILF, which came into popularity from the American Pie movie and fetishized by porn. I have never seen it being used as a slogan of solidarity with mothers and that feels hard to imagine.